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Post by sennaboy on May 3, 2009 20:07:37 GMT 1
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Post by towzt on May 3, 2009 22:04:38 GMT 1
ok, i just watched the replay; and scatter hit j and me i think. but he started braking in time, i think he just used his brakes hard enough. stiil his fault, but i think its one of his 1st mistakes that involve other drivers. it was bleubird that hit you, because he was trying too get into the gap that was on you inside. I had 2 awefull races, just got home from a really depressing baseball game (we lost 35-9 and just managed to get to qualify. i made some mistakes, and my tires started overheating, could do a few good laps and then my FF kept doing strange thing sometimes it was there; sometimes it just wasn't. 2nd race, was in 2nd until lap 7 or so when my tires where overheating again (wasn't sliding or anything) and suddely my back broke out; tires where glowing red, and the inner temp was browinsh :s. had to slow a bit down, ans then got in 7th wher i stayed i think. not a very memorable race, but i managed to keep driving an get a pretty nice lap time on hte board.
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Post by bluebird287 on May 3, 2009 22:46:49 GMT 1
ok, i just watched the replay; and scatter hit j and me i think. but he started braking in time, i think he just used his brakes hard enough. stiil his fault, but i think its one of his 1st mistakes that involve other drivers. it was bleubird that hit you, because he was trying too get into the gap that was on you inside. I had 2 awefull races, just got home from a really depressing baseball game (we lost 35-9 and just managed to get to qualify. i made some mistakes, and my tires started overheating, could do a few good laps and then my FF kept doing strange thing sometimes it was there; sometimes it just wasn't. 2nd race, was in 2nd until lap 7 or so when my tires where overheating again (wasn't sliding or anything) and suddely my back broke out; tires where glowing red, and the inner temp was browinsh :s. had to slow a bit down, ans then got in 7th wher i stayed i think. not a very memorable race, but i managed to keep driving an get a pretty nice lap time on hte board. Hej! i got hit from behind :S And i just kept on braking to try to avoid incident. pity i don' t have the replay of race 1:-(
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Post by hanziboy on May 3, 2009 23:28:34 GMT 1
Sorry I was to late to help admin this race.. 500servers could not be reached so LFS lapper was still online, maybe it is better to put it off on Saturday. Towz-t did not complete the 20 laps and he did qualify .. but the current admin did approve to let him in position.. but that off course in disadvantage of other drivers.. And yes maybe you drove them offline, but then everybody could tell that.. And that can't be the goal of the 20 lap rule we have.. But you have finished 23 Seconds before Rasta, so a 20 second penalty does not change the result. Well done..
For the incident on the first corner of the first race I see A lot of things go wrong. 1. Scatter hitting Jyuetsch. 2. Bleubird coming in way to hot causing a collision, surprising Sennaboy who was turning in. 3. Jyuetsch hit by Scatter did not look on upcoming traffic to rejoin race, causing Wellington and Bluebird to hit, because Wellington had no where else to go, to avoid Jyeutsch. 4. Scatter rejoining track without looking for upcoming traffic and made Knuckles to hit him.
So a lot of action. Bluebird surprising Sennaboy by being there but should realize all the cars on his left will come together on that same turn.. and diving in that corner like that makes collisions almost unavoidable. Certainly in a game where side view is almost impossible during this actions. LFSspotter ofcourse can help !! But indeed , Scatter, this time and I think the first time I remember it, the cause of a lot of trouble in the first corner. But I guess he already realizes this..
So still a lot of errors made in the first corner.. And the then I have to agree with Sennaboy to tell us ... AGAIN.. We all know he is one of the racers putting most laps online , being online a lot of times and helping us all with good setups.. but race after race he get's hit of track... You can imagine how frustrating that must be!!
And so again I have to repeat the race indeed is not won in the first corner but often lost....
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Post by bluebird287 on May 3, 2009 23:47:57 GMT 1
Sorry I was to late to help admin this race.. 500servers could not be reached so LFS lapper was still online, maybe it is better to put it off on Saturday. Towz-t did not complete the 20 laps and he did qualify .. but the current admin did approve to let him in position.. but that off course in disadvantage of other drivers.. And yes maybe you drove them offline, but then everybody could tell that.. And that can't be the goal of the 20 lap rule we have.. But you have finished 23 Seconds before Rasta, so a 20 second penalty does not change the result. Well done.. For the incident on the first corner of the first race I see A lot of things go wrong. 1. Scatter hitting Jyuetsch. 2. Bleubird coming in way to hot causing a collision, surprising Sennaboy who was turning in. 3. Jyuetsch hit by Scatter did not look on upcoming traffic to rejoin race, causing Wellington and Bluebird to hit, because Wellington had no where else to go, to avoid Jyeutsch. 4. Scatter rejoining track without looking for upcoming traffic and made Knuckles to hit him. So a lot of action. Bluebird surprising Sennaboy by being there but should realize all the cars on his left will come together on that same turn.. and diving in that corner like that makes collisions almost unavoidable. Certainly in a game where side view is almost impossible during this actions. LFSspotter ofcourse can help !! But indeed , Scatter, this time and I think the first time I remember it, the cause of a lot of trouble in the first corner. But I guess he already realizes this.. So still a lot of errors made in the first corner.. And the then I have to agree with Sennaboy to tell us ... AGAIN.. We all know he is one of the racers putting most laps online , being online a lot of times and helping us all with good setups.. but race after race he get's hit of track... You can imagine how frustrating that must be!! And so again I have to repeat the race indeed is not won in the first corner but often lost.... Disagree with point two. In replay, car on outside of me starts to brake at normal point but also starts to turn in very soon, apparently assuming nobody is on the inside. Notice his position of the steering wheel while braking and the skidmarks of the inner right tyre. In the brake-zone moving from total outside to inside while braking. Well, at a race-start that's something which certainly will lead to accidents. After that, the same car hits the brakes instead of driving through the gravel pits, ending his own race. From my perspective at the race, i felt like being rammed from behind adding speed to my car and making it impossible for me to drive over the inner curb as intended. It may looked like i went much too fast, but watch my speed at the moment i'm nearly done braking. I did not have any cars in front of me and had the nice inner side/line of the chicane and made sure speed was low enough so i could stay on the inside because i assume there will be trouble in T1. However, the hit added speed and turned my car a bit the wrong way. When i am at the point i have to brake for a corner, i never change line for two reasons: one: I cannot change line, because my car will go only in straight line while braking . Only when nearly done braking i might release the brakes slightly and steer a bit to force slight oversteer to get the car to turn in. two: nobody can avoid a car while braking except when max brake force is set too low. One last comment, i cannot avoid cars which i have passed for over 65% and still steers in as if driving alone on the track. Always be aware someone may be surprisingly good or better then you at braking. Usually i am the one who brakes last, but sometimes i find my match and what happens then.... no accident, because i do not assume i will be able to brake much later also the other driver may brake too late flying past me on my inside.
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Post by towzt on May 4, 2009 0:48:41 GMT 1
one: I cannot change line, because my car will go only in straight line while braking . Only when nearly done braking i might release the brakes slightly and steer a bit to force slight oversteer to get the car to turn in. two: nobody can avoid a car while braking except when max brake force is set too low. that is why; at turn1 most of us start braking 50m early and softer, to avoid thes kind of situations
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Post by towzt on May 4, 2009 1:00:15 GMT 1
don't get this wrong guys, not pointing the finger at anyone.
One more thing In J's defence
"3. Jyuetsch hit by Scatter did not look on upcoming traffic to rejoin race, causing Wellington and Bluebird to hit, because Wellington had no where else to go, to avoid Jyeutsch."
wasn't really Jyuetsch his fault if you ask me; he was still trying to keep his car straigt, braking (with back wheels on the grass) would send him in a spin, and he did everything he could to keep his car under controll. if he would have gone into a spin; he would have caused mayhem as well, becouse he would com on the track just behind T2 i think. i cant see whats wrong with keeping your car straight if you get hit.
My 20secs extra is correct off course.
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Post by xtian on May 4, 2009 7:38:57 GMT 1
I don't really the point in pointing who did what to whom. about half the cars didn't make it trhough turn 1 on race 1... nobody's perfect, I took out DRD on race two myself before I got thrown off track later on too. it's not like anyone was injured. Not knowing what happenend on T1 (I was P2 but saw all the little triangles all over the map), I called for restart, which could be assimilated to red flag in real life (that happens sometimes too) but nobody followed and Senna had disconnected already.
As for the 20 laps rules, My apologies. I wanted to start the race quicker and though towzt's times proved he knew the track and was fast and safe enough and that I would still respect the spirit of the rule if not follow the rule per se. better next time.
anyway, the single seaters we will be driving from now on do not resist to bumps and touches the way the tin top do. so we'll all have to be more carefull out there and exercice in group rather than alone to pop an impressive time.
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Post by hanziboy on May 4, 2009 8:06:12 GMT 1
don't get this wrong guys, not pointing the finger at anyone. One more thing In J's defence "3. Jyuetsch hit by Scatter did not look on upcoming traffic to rejoin race, causing Wellington and Bluebird to hit, because Wellington had no where else to go, to avoid Jyeutsch." wasn't really Jyuetsch his fault if you ask me; he was still trying to keep his car straigt, braking (with back wheels on the grass) would send him in a spin, and he did everything he could to keep his car under controll. if he would have gone into a spin; he would have caused mayhem as well, becouse he would com on the track just behind T2 i think. i cant see whats wrong with keeping your car straight if you get hit. My 20secs extra is correct off course. Oeps my mistake... I have already watched the replay a lot of times, will review it once more this evening.
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Post by hanziboy on May 4, 2009 8:20:49 GMT 1
@ towz-t and Jyeutsch . Oeps if that is the case... I must have overlooked this. I have allready reviewed it a lot of time but one to many.. will do this tonight. Would also not have resulted in a penalty because I also realize he was a victim of Scatter. I was just a reminder to repeat it to the others to watch out rejoining the track, even if you are a victim. (Rule 8.11)
@ Xtian: A restart is never given (Rule 6.6).. i know leagues where it is given ..but this only results in more T1 problems and more racers taken risks. If it goes wrong, we all start over again. SC here was possible even if no one was stuck. A SC can be called out from the racer in problems and from the admin when they feel the need for it. So they could all regroup and have a rolling start.
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Post by sennaboy on May 4, 2009 13:12:18 GMT 1
One last comment, i cannot avoid cars which i have passed for over 65% and still steers in as if driving alone on the track. Always be aware someone may be surprisingly good or better then you at braking. Usually i am the one who brakes last, but sometimes i find my match and what happens then.... no accident, because i do not assume i will be able to brake much later also the other driver may brake too late flying past me on my inside
Ok,
looks like i did it all wrong again, next time i take last place and rest on that place so i only got to diffent my last place. did my 20 laps (litle more) so i'm offline and don't come online anymore so i can do nothing wrong anymore.Maybe come online but only to watch you guys. So admins i did it wrong so give me my penalty shoot on me!
greets sennaboy
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Post by gnomie on May 4, 2009 13:31:03 GMT 1
I never got around to doing any practice at all until Sunday, and when I finally did some laps offline on Sunday evening it became obvious that it would not be safe for me to enter the race. I have very little experience with these cars.. all my sim-time lately has been taken up by iRacing and rFactor with the HistorX mod. My final exams start in about two weeks, so I don't have all that much time on my hands these days. I'll try to make it to the practice race next weekend, but after that I won't be able to do any more races before summer I'm afraid. Hope to be back again next season!!
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Post by towzt on May 4, 2009 14:58:22 GMT 1
senna, it wasn't your fault at all. you tried to avoid an accident and so did others, but if it was someones fault; it wasn't yours for shure
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Post by SLO_Scatter on May 4, 2009 15:43:25 GMT 1
senna, it wasn't your fault at all. you tried to avoid an accident and so did others, but if it was someones fault; it wasn't yours for shure Correct !!! It was not Senna's fault. It was all my fault for the trouble in turn 1. I take full responsibility for my actions and the penalties incurred because of those actions. I apologize to everyone for causing the wreck. Whether you decide to accept my apology is entirely up to everyone in the league. I can't force you to accept it.
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Post by towzt on May 4, 2009 18:28:44 GMT 1
ok, i suggest a basher race at the end of the season, so everyone can let his frustrations out, 5x 5 rallycross laps, and hitting eachother is allowed
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