pe
Full Member
OLD_Mumhra
Posts: 104
|
Post by pe on Jan 10, 2008 8:51:04 GMT 1
Yep... we tested it yesterday and we came to the conclusion that we can't let the computer start this race. This is because all cars that join are placed on the exact same position. So if you were to let the computer start the 2 cars are in eachother and a hughe crash follows.
Joining a race is also impossible because when 1 car is on the track the 2nd one can't join because when he tries to join he will place the car on the exact same place as where car 1 is and the computer says you can't join because the start is blocked.
So i tried remaking the track. I have no idea about track making in LFS but i am a well known track maker in MTM2 so this maybe gives me a little edge. I started looking on why the cars are in the exact same start position and after a while i found this
all you have to do is not put a START object in your layout. When you don't place a starting line "arrow", all cars online will be put on a predefined grid in a staggered formation. At the Autocross lot, they all start at those starting lights. On the Carpark they start near the Castrol signs I think it is. Just test it for yourself
This means that all the cars are placed at a default starting position as long as you don't place the start arrow. From the moment you put the start arrow all cars are placed on that start arrow and since you can only put 1 start arrow that is every time the exact same start place and therefor collisions always happen. I have tried removing the start arrow but the default start position is not on the track at all so that is impossible to use. Remaking the track so that the start is on the track is maybe not impossible but very difficult to do. The maker of this track was a pro trackmaker and if i were to remake it then i'm sure that it will be filled with errors.
So as i see it we only have 1 solution to this : Start somewhere else on the track. then drive slowly to the start position and then give the start ourselves. How that has to happen still is unclear to me. Maybe teamspeak is a solution here...
I'm going to try what is best now. Remove the start arrow so both cars can drive slowly to the correct starting position (if that is not to far from the track it must be possible) or put the start arrow close to the track so that every car just has to drive slowly onto the track and take the start position. In this case you have to start the race with 1 car and let another car join from the moment car #1 is on his starting place.
|
|
pe
Full Member
OLD_Mumhra
Posts: 104
|
Post by pe on Jan 10, 2008 10:09:06 GMT 1
Hey all... me again lol. After extensive testing and trying to remake the track we came to the conclusion that it is impossible to host the ROC race on the official ROC track without using TS to give the startsignal. But we are not very keen on the idea because it won't ever be fair since it's possible to jump the start and ofcourse there always is a little lag on TS. That means that people that live far away from here might here the signal a little later then people living close so they will always have a handicap. Therefor we started looking for another ROC track. And guess what... we found one and we are 99% sure that on this ROC track it is possible to let the computer give the start signal. Also the track is wider then the first one so there is more room for errors. The track is longer but also faster then the official ROC track. The races will last a little longer. I'm guessing around 2min45 each race. Anyway.. forget about the official ROC track. This is the one that will be used : www.lfsforum.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=11377&d=1149888673And here are some screen shots : Danny, Hans and me will test this thoroughly this evening but we are 99% sure that it must be possible to host a fair ROC race on this unofficial ROC track. For those who interested to see such a ROC event in LFS we found this little movie online : www.youtube.com/watch?v=dH2WWyX5xsQ
|
|
|
Post by xtian on Jan 10, 2008 14:19:25 GMT 1
or an admin could configure his f2->f4 keys to "three - two one-go" and use the ingame chat ?
|
|
pe
Full Member
OLD_Mumhra
Posts: 104
|
Post by pe on Jan 10, 2008 14:52:37 GMT 1
That is possible yes but i'm scared that there will be to much arguing going on if someone was to start a little early. If this second track works properly we don't have to worry about false starts because the computer will see them so i think that that is the way to go.
Besides this track is actually more fun than the official ROC track. It's a lot wider so you can drift easier through the turns. Also there are no cones placed so you can't recieve penalty's for knocking them over.
OK.. i would've liked the official track as well but this one is better and does not have the starting problem. so i think the choice is obvious...
|
|
pe
Full Member
OLD_Mumhra
Posts: 104
|
Post by pe on Jan 10, 2008 22:14:00 GMT 1
Sign ups for this event are closed.
This because we just had a test session and we think that with 8 on the start the complete event will take long enough. It will be hard enough as it is. You can still sign up as a spare racer. If one of the 8 allready entered can't make it you can take his place.
As i said before we just had a serious test on this and it looks like it will be fun but we need everybody at their best behaviour for this event. It's not easy organizing this so please all obey some ground rules :
1. DO NOT CHAT. Hanziboy will say who is allowed to join a race so we all want to hear that. You can chat all you want during a race. Racers can block messages so that they won't be disturbed. During the race you can chat all you want, cheer for someone, put money on someone ;D or whatever you want. But from the moment the race is over we need complete silence.
2. Now lets look at how a start procedure will work : - I (Mumhra) will say which car will be used. All racers are to go to the garage and pick that car with "hard track" setup. - Hanziboy will say a name. That rider is to join the race by pressing the "join race" button. DO NOT press ready - Sennaboy will always join as 2nd racer. When Sennaboy has to race himself I will join as 2nd racer. If I have to race Sennaboy then Hans will join as 2nd racer - Hans will say another name. Then that rider is to join by pressing the "join race" button. - Then all 3 racers click the ready button - From the moment all 3 cars are on the grid the 2nd racer (normally Senna, but it can be me or Hans) presses shift-S in order to spectate - The other two wait for the lights to go green and then have to finish their 4 laps as quickly as possible.
3. Every race will consist of 2 or 3 heats. In heat 1 racer 1 is in the left lane, racer 2 in the right lane. In race 2 those 2 racers swap places. Winner is best 2 out of 3 so if it is 1-1 after 2 rounds a 3rd round will decide on who wins the race. For this 3rd race the racers will again swap places.
4. There are 4 cars that will be used. The XFG, XRT, RB4 and LX4 and they will be used in this sequense as well. In order to decide which car we start with i will, just before the event, ask somebody of the racers to name a car. 1 of those 4. That car will be used in heat 1. In heat 2 the next car will be used, in heat 3 the next,...
5. Let's look at the races that are going to take place : - Race 1 : heat 1 : racer 1 (left lane) vs racer 2 (right lane) heat 2 : racer 2 (left lane) vs racer 1 (right lane) heat 3 : racer 1 (left lane) vs racer 2 (right lane) (race if needed) - race 2 : heat 1 : racer 3 vs racer 4 heat 2 : racer 4 vs racer 3 heat 3 : racer 3 vs racer 4 (if needed) - race 3 : heat 1 : racer 5 vs racer 6 heat 2 : racer 6 vs racer 5 heat 3 : racer 5 vs racer 6 (if needed) - race 4 : heat 1 : racer 7 vs racer 8 heat 2 : racer 8 vs racer 7 heat 3 : racer 7 vs racer 8 - race 5 : heat 1 : winner race 1 vs winner race 2 heat 2 : winner race 2 vs winner race 1 heat 3 : winner race 1 vs winner race (if needed) - race 6 : heat 1 : winner race 3 vs winner race 4 heat 2 : winner race 4 vs winner race 3 heat 3 : winner race 3 vs winner race 4 (if needed) - race 7 : heat 1 : loser race 5 vs loser race 6 heat 2 : loser race 6 vs loser race 5 heat 3 : loser race 5 vs loser race 6 (if needed) - race 8 : heat 1 : winner race 5 vs winner race 6 heat 2 : winner race 6 vs winner race 5 heat 3 : winner race 5 vs winner race 6 (if needed) the winner of race 8 win will the gold medal, the loser of race 8 the silver one and the winner of race 7 will win the bronze medal.
5. In order to know who racer 1, 2, 3, etc etc etc will be i will ask the assistence of Shadowprincess. Most of you don't know her but she is the tournament host in MTM2 racing tournaments. Every week she hosts a racing tourney. I will ask her from the moment i see her online to work her magic and i will post the names as soon as possible.
6. Have fun. This is ment to be a fun event. Scoring or placing is not important. The important thing is to have fun
7. Give us a little credit if anything goes wrong. It's not easy to host this lol. We are doing the best we can.
|
|
|
Post by xtian on Jan 11, 2008 4:45:01 GMT 1
my head hurts now will it remain as tested ? - no penalty for hitting a wall (althou they turn the track into a pinball machine) - reset allowed ?
|
|
pe
Full Member
OLD_Mumhra
Posts: 104
|
Post by pe on Jan 11, 2008 8:36:46 GMT 1
No penaltys no. The risk of hitting a wall is big enough. Chances are your car will be thrown in the air. And reset will be allowed yes.
|
|
|
Post by hanziboy on Jan 11, 2008 9:16:47 GMT 1
And reset will be allowed yes. Error, no I don't think reset will be allowed. We are always searching for the most realistic game and even changed track because we want to have a fair race with a clean start.. Resetting is not fair and sure not realistic. Yesterday I enabled it because we were in test mode and could evaluate a complete race, without the need to restart (complex) after a crash. Cu on track!! Hanziboy
|
|
pe
Full Member
OLD_Mumhra
Posts: 104
|
Post by pe on Jan 11, 2008 9:33:59 GMT 1
OK Hans. Sorry i gave wrong info
|
|
pe
Full Member
OLD_Mumhra
Posts: 104
|
Post by pe on Jan 13, 2008 8:56:00 GMT 1
I met up with Shadowprincess yesterday after the first monster truck tournament of the year and she filled in the names in her tournament tool. Here is a screeny of that convo : Don't forget that before the event i will ask 1 of you guys with what car race 1 heat 1 will get underway. Heat 2 will be the next car. Heat 3 the next. If there is no heat 3 but we go directly to race 2 heat 1 we will simply pick the next car in line that heat. So we won't skip a car so noone will know what car they will have to race with. I will tell Hanziboy first who that guy will be that will decide with which car we will start so you guys will know that there is no cheating there either. So this is what the event will look like : - race 1 (Sennaboy will always join as 2nd in this race) : heat 1 : Jyuetsch (left lane) vs OLD_Yomega (right lane) heat 2 : OLD_Yomega (left lane) vs Jyuetsch (right lane) If needed heat 3 : Jyuetsch (left lane) vs OLD_Yomega (right lane) - race 2 (OLD_Mumhra will always join as 2nd in this race) : heat 1 : Hanziboy (left lane) vs Sennaboy (right lane) heat 2 : Sennaboy (left lane) vs Hanziboy (right lane) If needed heat 3 : Hanziboy (left lane) vs Sennaboy (right lane) - race 3 (Sennaboy will always join as 2nd in this race) : heat 1 : Gnomie (left lane) vs OLD_Mumhra (right lane) heat 2 : OLD_Mumhra (left lane) vs Gnomie (right lane) If needed heat 3 : Gnomie (left lane) vs OLD_Mumhra (right lane) - race 4 ( Sennaboy will always join as 2nd in this race) : heat 1 : SLO_Scatter (left lane) vs Xtian (right lane) heat 2 : Xtian (left lane) vs SLO_Scatter (right lane) If needed heat 3 : SLO_Scatter (left lane) vs Xtian (right lane) - race 5 : heat 1 : winner race 1 vs winner race 2 heat 2 : winner race 2 vs winner race 1 heat 3 : winner race 1 vs winner race (if needed) - race 6 : heat 1 : winner race 3 vs winner race 4 heat 2 : winner race 4 vs winner race 3 heat 3 : winner race 3 vs winner race 4 (if needed) - race 7 : heat 1 : loser race 5 vs loser race 6 heat 2 : loser race 6 vs loser race 5 heat 3 : loser race 5 vs loser race 6 (if needed) - race 8 : heat 1 : winner race 5 vs winner race 6 heat 2 : winner race 6 vs winner race 5 heat 3 : winner race 5 vs winner race 6 (if needed)
|
|
|
Post by gnomie on Jan 13, 2008 10:24:12 GMT 1
Wow, I'm impressed! You sure put a lot of work into this. I'm looking forward to it! It's still scheduled for January 27th, right?
|
|
|
Post by hanziboy on Jan 13, 2008 13:34:50 GMT 1
Nice work indeed Pe, And I've made an Workscheet (Excel) to follo the ROC a little bit easier. It is made in MS Office 2003. The people who don't have MS Office can also install the FREE Open Office ( www.openoffice.org ) It's a Free Office that also handles Word, excel and Powerpoint files !! If you fill in the winner of each heat and race, the names for next race will be filled in automaticaly !! Sheet can be found here : www.belsimracing.be/docs/BSR_ROC1.xlsHope you like it Cu all on track !! Hanziboy
|
|
|
Post by sennaboy on Jan 23, 2008 9:10:51 GMT 1
Hi all,
If someone will take my place for the race of champions sunday, they can do it.I'm not in the mood to drive.
cu all, verbeke danny
|
|
pe
Full Member
OLD_Mumhra
Posts: 104
|
Post by pe on Jan 24, 2008 19:46:06 GMT 1
Well... looks like noone is interested. Thnx Senna... But that won't stop me having fun in this event. We will just reschedule it a bit. I suggest we keep this event on the 23b server and we do it on sunday and start at the usual hour which is 20.30 for people who live in Europe. No idea what hour it is for the american racers but i thrust on it that they know that. Instead of Sennaboy I will always be the 2nd racer who will join and then go into spectator mode. race 1 will be Jyuetsch vs OLD_Yomega. race 2 will be Gnomie vs OLD_Mumhra race 3 will be SLO_Scatter vs Xtian In race 4 Hanziboy will have to face the best loser Now how to determine who is the best loser ? Well.... a loser that can win 1 of his 3 racers is a good loser. - So if only 1 of the 3 losers can win 1 race then he is the best loser. - If there are 2 losers that can win 1 race then both of them will have to do a runoff before race 4 to determine which one of them is the best loser - If there are 0 or 3 losers that have won 1 race then all 3 of them will have to raceoff. Each loser has to race another loser once and by that we can see who is the best of the 3 losers. These loser raceoffs are not best 2 out of 3 races. 1 race determines all. They just step into the next car and do their race. That's it. After these loser races Hanziboy races the best loser in a best 2 out of 3 heats. Then we just go ahead as planned. One final word of thanks to Sennaboy. I'm sorry but this is not the way that i'm used to working with people. If i promise something i stick to my end of the deal. Maybe asking this from other people is to much. I have no idea. It looks like it anyway. I for one am sick and tired of this "i quit", "i don't quit", "i quit", "i don't quit",... Sorry but i have to get it of my chest.. btw.. Hans, can you pls setup ROC layout on 23b server ? Thank you
|
|
|
Post by gnomie on Jan 24, 2008 22:29:14 GMT 1
One final word of thanks to Sennaboy. I'm sorry but this is not the way that i'm used to working with people. If i promise something i stick to my end of the deal. Maybe asking this from other people is to much. I have no idea. It looks like it anyway. I for one am sick and tired of this "i quit", "i don't quit", "i quit", "i don't quit",... Sorry but i have to get it of my chest.. I have to agree with this. A deal is a deal. IMO it would have been a different matter if Senna had offered to give away his spot if someone wanted it, but simply backing out alltogether is not very nice.. especially since he should know how much effort goes into organizing something like this.
|
|