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Post by hanziboy on Feb 3, 2009 10:24:08 GMT 1
Page 5... ;D ;D
I also think Scatter did a good job on bringing out the SC out.. and even if the car recovers, the he simply comes in again after they all come back in a row, unless it is forced to come back on the leader..But I don't think some one would try this..the risks are very high... And of course the replay would tell.
The Reset............ I am completely agree we should not use it when you can crawl back to the pit. But I also have already hit the front of the pitwall.. they your of into the sky.. back on the roof... In that cases, your on the roof, I think we should have the possibility to reset. Ok not realistic. But we don't lose the racer, so more action, the driver can collect more experience..
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Post by humbleridderen on Feb 3, 2009 11:11:56 GMT 1
Hi all, it seems i play it wrong Well i hit my brake ones , the first SC. After that braking in the first safety car i dint brake anymore before starting and giving full tortle i put my car in 4th gear an slow down, waiting for the moment to fly away.I asked it to admin Hans and he said i could play it that way , nobody said i had to hold a minimum of 100 km/h , so i was think i play it well.Sorry if i do it wrong. greets sennaboy Sennaboy, you did a very good race and you deserve the win totally!!! Grats I don´t know, if you are referring to my post, where I mentioned you. I said, what i observed and what I thought, could be the purpose. I didn´t say that it´s wrong. You did what was allowed. I was just answering scatter, because he was in doubt whether he did it right. But, when that´s is said, i think we should have a minimum distance between the cars. In formula one, it´s 10 car lengths.. We were only everything from 0-4 car lenghts at it´s all too risky. If the front car slows down, even you don´t hit the brakes, it happens very fast and if you are near to the car in front, you will hit him. About the cold tyres: In general, i think it´s up to the drivers to control a car with cold tyres. When I had cold tyres, I didn´t go maximum from the beginning, easened the throotle on the narrow turns, and even took broader lines. Even if I lost position on that. I did that once for example and lost a position, and then just after i saw the car who had passed me, going into the wall. Probably because of the cold tyres. That way i regained my position. But I think, we HAVE to follow the Safetyvcar speed. He is controling the field. When he drives into the pit at the scones, then the front car is allowed to slow down and the cars behind shall hold a minimum distance..for example 4 car lengths.
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Post by hanziboy on Feb 3, 2009 11:17:12 GMT 1
But I think, we HAVE to follow the Safetyvcar speed. He is controling the field. When he drives into the pit at the scones, then the front car is allowed to slow down and the cars behind shall hold a minimum distance..for example 4 car lengths. I disagree..We should play it like it is in the States.. Keep the same speed, don't slow down.. And floor it whenever you want (before the Start/finish line). and if you do.. you keep it that way.. That is the only save way to do it and keep it on close racing. I was at the back a few times and was horrible when the pack slowed down.. hitting the guy in front of me and get hit in the back..
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Post by humbleridderen on Feb 3, 2009 11:25:24 GMT 1
But I think, we HAVE to follow the Safetyvcar speed. He is controling the field. When he drives into the pit at the scones, then the front car is allowed to slow down and the cars behind shall hold a minimum distance..for example 4 car lengths. I disagree..We should play it like it is in the States.. Keep the same speed, don't slow down.. And floor it whenever you want (before the Start/finish line). and if you do.. you keep it that way.. That is the only save way to do it and keep it on close racing. I was at the back a few times and was horrible when the pack slowed down.. hitting the guy in front of me and get hit in the back.. What ever, but a minimum distance, between the cars I think is important. Hm..did I understand you right??? Do you have a msn or skype adress?
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Post by hanziboy on Feb 3, 2009 13:32:40 GMT 1
Hi all, it seems i play it wrong Well i hit my brake ones , the first SC. After that braking in the first safety car i dint brake anymore before starting and giving full tortle i put my car in 4th gear an slow down, waiting for the moment to fly away.I asked it to admin Hans and he said i could play it that way , nobody said i had to hold a minimum of 100 km/h , so i was think i play it well.Sorry if i do it wrong. greets sennaboy That is why also those Practice sessions are more important then most of us think. And indeed you did nothing wrong,, but it changes slightly for the official race
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pe
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OLD_Mumhra
Posts: 104
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Post by pe on Feb 3, 2009 13:41:08 GMT 1
Hi all, it seems i play it wrong Well i hit my brake ones , the first SC. After that braking in the first safety car i dint brake anymore before starting and giving full tortle i put my car in 4th gear an slow down, waiting for the moment to fly away.I asked it to admin Hans and he said i could play it that way , nobody said i had to hold a minimum of 100 km/h , so i was think i play it well.Sorry if i do it wrong. greets sennaboy You did not play it wrong Sennaboy. Like i said before, you just did it like we are used to over here in Europe. And just like i said before, the reason we do it here is so that the cars behind you can't overtake you. This was invented by Michael Schumacher. He accelerated and braked so often that everybody behind him was concentrating on not hitting the car in front of them and could not concentrate on the green flag no more. By doing that noone could pass Michael Schumacher at a restart after a yellow flag situation. You played it like that (a little bit more gently since you only braked the first time) but every time you went so slow that the cars at the back had to concentrate fully on braking and shifting down in order not to hit the car in front of them. That was not against the rules what you did. Besides the braking there were no rules. So you did it like we are used to over here in Europe, the Michael Schumacher way lol. But there is a hughe difference between how Schumacher did it and how it's done in Nascar (or every other form of oval racing). Only natural since the speeds are much higher on ovals and people don't want to get killed on the track lol. Just go out on youtube and look for some restarts in Nascar. It's unbelievable how close they are to eachother and that is only because the lead car holds its speed. Also look for some restarts after safety car situations in F1. You will see that there is a hughe difference. It was easy for you being at the front. But do me a favour and look at the replay inside a car at the back of the pack. Just look how difficult we had it back there. I often thought that you went for it and then noticed that i was wrong. Then i had to brake ofcourse which was very dangerous for the car behind me. When you finally did decide to go I was in the wrong gear, or just on the brake or whatever which every time resulted in a hughe gap between the cars and since we use safety cars in order to have a close race that is not what we were looking for. Again, don't get me wrong. I am not attacking you at all. You played it by the rules. I'm just asking the admins if we are going to maintain the same rules at the feature race since, according to me, it is to dangerous like this.
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Post by towzt on Feb 3, 2009 14:12:03 GMT 1
to make it more complicated: i think the nascar rules says, when a sefatycar comes in, and you have a green f*g (when the SC reaches start finish line in the pit) you can start passing the other cars, but only on the outside. i was behind knuckels i think on one of the last restarts, and he missed his start completely, upon every body behind him (that would be me, myself and i) had to wait for him to get going. i you allow passing on the outside, people will get closer to eachother, and the race leader wont slow down anymore 1)So safety car comes in: Leader keeps speed of sc (160KM/H or whatever it is) 2)SC crosses start finish: GREEN FLAG (passing allowed on outside line) 3)You start Start/finish: all hell brakes loose
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Post by xtian on Feb 3, 2009 15:18:05 GMT 1
I agree that the leading car should keep a reasonnable speed. remember that in next season, we won't have a real SC, it will be up to the leader of the race to hold the pack. now just imagine that I see car #2 on its top in aston GP, it can take a LOT of time before everybody rejoins in a single row, probable several laps. my opinion it that other than oval races, when SC is called, the leading car must gradually reduce speed to a safe minimum in order to let everyone regain a position in the line at a reasonnable speed, no more passing, blue flag included. but once everybody is in a line, the speed should be constant and the leader decides when he wants to floor it once the SC has been called back in the pits (metaphorically) but only in the last straight line (passing start/finish). it's not like we're doing one of those indoor bicycle sprint race when they look at each other over their shoulder and try to take the other runner by surprise!
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Post by SLO_Scatter on Feb 3, 2009 15:33:24 GMT 1
That's what practice races are for, to sort out any potential problems. Everything's good. I'm sure everyone will try to do better this Sunday.
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Post by sennaboy on Feb 3, 2009 15:35:57 GMT 1
Don't worry Pé, i think if we must stay after the SC and the leader cant slowdown a Little before going again, and give a suprisestart that it will be very easy for the second and the third car to pass the leader. reason the leader can't slipstream. sennaboy
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pe
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OLD_Mumhra
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Post by pe on Feb 3, 2009 15:40:46 GMT 1
Don't worry Pé, i think if we must stay after the sc and the leader cant slowdown a litle before going again, and give a suprisestart that it wil be verry easy for the second and the third car to pass the leader. reason the leader can't slipstream. True Sennaboy. It is very easy for the 2nd to pass the leader. But it also is very easy for that leader, once he is passed, to take back his 1st place. And that is what we are looking for, not ? Close racing, slipstreaming and lots of overtakings. It actually is very good that you did it the way you did. Now we can discuss this. If you always did it like we are suggesting now this conversation never would've came up. And when raceday comes and someone else is leading the pack he could do it like you did the first time with braking and everything. Now we know up front what is expected of us.
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Post by SLO_Scatter on Feb 3, 2009 17:26:36 GMT 1
I did some investigating and found some videos of restarts on YouTube. Just look at the distance between the SC/Pacecar and the field. Also watch where the SC/Pacecar enters the pits, that's why I entered the pits where I did. I can enter at the cones though, no problem. The restart is at the 2:15 mark. www.youtube.com/watch?v=lCa78JM2haQ&feature=relatedThere are 3 laps to go after this restart. Jeff Gordon gets spun after the start, but since he's able to get going again there is no caution flag. www.youtube.com/watch?v=LtCbwfqD5t0This video shows the start of the race instead of a restart, but you see where the SC/Pacecar is in relation to the field. www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y361jJuC0IEGood view of the restart in this video too. www.youtube.com/watch?v=NeNqb_eH0mMedit: You're right Mum, European and American restarts are a little different.
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pe
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OLD_Mumhra
Posts: 104
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Post by pe on Feb 3, 2009 18:01:27 GMT 1
I can enter at the cones though, no problem It does not matter where you enter the pitlane Scatter. It's ok if you enter it where you did. But we need to know where it is going to happen. Not one time at the wall and another time at the cones or vice versa. It has to be the same place every time. edit: You're right Mum, European and American restarts are a little different. That's the difference between European and American racing. Europeans drive more defensive while Americans tend to attack harder. You don't only see that difference in car racing. Motocross is exactly the same. When they race together you can easily see who is from Europe and who is from America. A European rider takes his time. If he is behind someone he waits for a few laps and looks where the best place is to pass the guy in front of him. An American rider thinks a lot less. He just goes for it and if he fails he will try again in the next turn. And that was exactly what Sennaboy's problem was. last weekend His first thought was that he would be passed easily if he played it like we suggested it. In Europe the drivers think about how they can make sure that they won't get passed before the green flag falls. They come up with all sorts of tricks in order to stay in first position with a lead as big as possible. In America racers don't think like that. From the moment the safety car gets out of the way they just floor it and they will see what happens next. If they get passed they will try and take back the lead asap. I don't know which driving (or riding) style is better. Americans tend to go a little faster but they make more mistakes. It's just how you grew up racing i think.
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Post by humbleridderen on Feb 3, 2009 18:03:20 GMT 1
Wouw, nice videos, Scatter! I must say, that american racing style is never boring..both Nascar and Champcar, Indycar etc. Champcar is not there anymore, i think!, but Indycar is. (or how is it, americans?)It was nice the concept, with mixed ovals and all kind of race tracks..even the airbase tracks.
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Post by SLO_Scatter on Feb 3, 2009 19:50:38 GMT 1
@mum: That's not always true of all American drivers/riders. We have drivers that will let the pacecar pull into the pits while they bring the field to the restart slow, or sometimes faster. And if the leader has done multiple restarts during a race he almost never does the same thing twice when restarting. That keeps the people behind him uncertain about when to hit the gas. I think it's the same with European drivers too. This Sunday I'll enter the pits at the cones. That might make it easier for me to get the text out sooner that the pits are open since I have to take my hand off of the controller. humbleridderen: Champ car is indeed gone. Those teams, the ones that could afford the change, went to the Indy Racing League. They are running more of a variety than they did when they started. They run on oval, street course, and road course. They got rid of the airport course at Cleveland, but they are running the airport course at Edmonton. www.indycar.com/schedule/
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